The "proof" of the Christian God being fake

For discussing religion and related topics.

Re: The "proof" of the Christian God being fake

Post by anarchy420x on Mon Dec 17, 2012 12:56 am
([msg=71741]see Re: The "proof" of the Christian God being fake[/msg])

Threethumb, as a person who doesn't find faith in "God", I find your statement to be in poor standing. By saying that "God" is indeed flawed for making a something that was flawed, is like saying that a manufacture who makes razorblades failed because they decay. Simply put, the manufacture may have intended the razorblades to decay to increase the demand thus increasing profits. God may have intended man to be flawed to give him a true choice in his beliefs by giving him hardships and trials to test those beliefs. This can be described in another way; When two people get into a relationship they thing the world is metaphorically perfect. Only upon encountering hardships do they realize how strong or weak their relationship truly is. Moreover, if you suggest that humans would be perfect lovers to a "God" or themselves if they were perfect, then you not they would have anything to compare their love to let alone their pleasure. "God" might seeing as he might be omnipotent, hell he might even know who would truly love him or not. However, Humans would not have the foresight, hindsight or side-sight capable of determining this. Their love could never truly be anything more or less than a constant just as gravity was when the earth was flat. Sorry sir or ma'am, but you simply do not have a leg to stand on.
A broken clock is right twice a day, however, I am neither up that early nor up that late...
anarchy420x
Poster
Poster
 
Posts: 279
Joined: Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:43 am
Blog: View Blog (0)


Re: The "proof" of the Christian God being fake

Post by Threethumb on Mon Dec 17, 2012 8:05 am
([msg=71744]see Re: The "proof" of the Christian God being fake[/msg])

I've heard this before, "maybe he meant to make them flawed", but I don't buy it. Because why would he? Why would he make humanity flawed if he expected them to have no flaws (not eating the apple, not killing each other). Did he create them flawed for the sole purpose of giving them the opportunity to make mistakes? It may sound plausible at this level, but when you think about how he punishes mistakes, why did he ever include the possibility of making them? When he punishes their flaws, there's no real reason for having made those flaws. With your logic, he's a sadistic and far from benevolent entity, to create humans so that they will make mistakes he then proceeds to punish them for. I mean, he knows everything, so there's no way he didn't know they would act up on their flaws. This to me seems like telling your baby to not eat its favorite candy, then put its favorite candy right besides it and punish the baby if you later on find that it ate the candy. It's like you WANT to punish the baby for nothing, so you create an excuse to do so. This is meaningless, cruel, and not something a "perfect" being would do.
Threethumb
New User
New User
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Tue Dec 11, 2012 10:13 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)


Re: The "proof" of the Christian God being fake

Post by pretentious on Mon Dec 17, 2012 10:43 am
([msg=71745]see Re: The "proof" of the Christian God being fake[/msg])

Threethumb wrote:to create humans so that they will make mistakes he then proceeds to punish them for. I mean, he knows everything, so there's no way he didn't know they would act up on their flaws

I don't really want to get involved in a religious debate, but i'd love to have someone explain this to me. Ok so given that god is omnipotent, all powerful and all knowing, he created me, knowing full well that i would not believe in him and that when i die he will send me to hell. By definition, god has made the decision from the start that he's gonna wish me into existence just to send me to hell for eternity and all that bad stuff. what a douche :P
Goatboy wrote:Oh, that's simple. All you need to do is dedicate many years of your life to studying security.

IF you feel like exchanging ASCII arrays, let me know ;)
pretentious wrote:Welcome to bat country
User avatar
pretentious
Poster
Poster
 
Posts: 458
Joined: Wed Mar 03, 2010 12:48 am
Blog: View Blog (0)


Re: The "proof" of the Christian God being fake

Post by anarchy420x on Mon Dec 17, 2012 5:00 pm
([msg=71753]see Re: The "proof" of the Christian God being fake[/msg])

Threethumb, you are under the assumption that "God" isn't wrathful. Look at the old testament, he is a sadistic old goat. If he made man flawed, it was to over come this. It gave man true choice and by creating terrible punishments it steers man in the right direction, which is only fair. I would rather have people believe in a sadistic, wrathful "God" than a helpless benevolent one. If "God" does not care, then it is easier to put the pieces together. I digress, there are many angles of looking ideology because of this we have circular logic. The bible plays well in to circular logic; you just have to change the angle of your argument to find the right answer.

-- Mon Dec 17, 2012 5:06 pm --

pretentious wrote:
Threethumb wrote:to create humans so that they will make mistakes he then proceeds to punish them for. I mean, he knows everything, so there's no way he didn't know they would act up on their flaws

I don't really want to get involved in a religious debate, but i'd love to have someone explain this to me. Ok so given that god is omnipotent, all powerful and all knowing, he created me, knowing full well that i would not believe in him and that when i die he will send me to hell. By definition, god has made the decision from the start that he's gonna wish me into existence just to send me to hell for eternity and all that bad stuff. what a douche :P


"God" being Omniscient is a controversial topic that can neither be proven or dis-proven at our current level of knowledge. The root of this is questioning "God's" existence; if he does not exist, then obviously he is not Omniscient. Moreover, you didn't ask a question but made a statement. Did you have a question or did you just want to call their "God" a douche?
A broken clock is right twice a day, however, I am neither up that early nor up that late...
anarchy420x
Poster
Poster
 
Posts: 279
Joined: Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:43 am
Blog: View Blog (0)


Re: The "proof" of the Christian God being fake

Post by Threethumb on Mon Dec 17, 2012 6:42 pm
([msg=71756]see Re: The "proof" of the Christian God being fake[/msg])

Well, there's one of the contradictions in the Bible.. He is described by definition as benevolent, but by action as wrathful. I've read some of the Bible, and I remember thinking that contradictions like these are abundant in it.

Regarding the issue of omnipotence, we actually have a piece of logic to prove that omnipotence in itself is a paradox, an impossibility. We can do this by asking the question: Could an omnipotent being create a stone so heavy that even he could not lift it? If he could lift the rock, then he's no longer classifiable as omnipotent, as the rock he creates aren't heavy enough; if he could not lift it, then the fact that things can be too heavy for him to lift means he wasn't omnipotent to being with.
Threethumb
New User
New User
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Tue Dec 11, 2012 10:13 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)


Re: The "proof" of the Christian God being fake

Post by anarchy420x on Mon Dec 17, 2012 7:21 pm
([msg=71758]see Re: The "proof" of the Christian God being fake[/msg])

If got was Omnipotent, then he would most certainly make a rock so heavy he both could and could not lift it. He could certainly make it exist in every state all at once. Moreover, he might also choose not to create a paradox.
A broken clock is right twice a day, however, I am neither up that early nor up that late...
anarchy420x
Poster
Poster
 
Posts: 279
Joined: Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:43 am
Blog: View Blog (0)


Re: The "proof" of the Christian God being fake

Post by pretentious on Mon Dec 17, 2012 7:23 pm
([msg=71759]see Re: The "proof" of the Christian God being fake[/msg])

anarchy420x wrote:you didn't ask a question but made a statement. Did you have a question or did you just want to call their "God" a douche?

i didn't have a question, i had a vague understanding of God's theoretical nature and wanted an explaination. I also wanted to call God a douche :D
Goatboy wrote:Oh, that's simple. All you need to do is dedicate many years of your life to studying security.

IF you feel like exchanging ASCII arrays, let me know ;)
pretentious wrote:Welcome to bat country
User avatar
pretentious
Poster
Poster
 
Posts: 458
Joined: Wed Mar 03, 2010 12:48 am
Blog: View Blog (0)


Re: The "proof" of the Christian God being fake

Post by anarchy420x on Mon Dec 17, 2012 7:25 pm
([msg=71760]see Re: The "proof" of the Christian God being fake[/msg])

pretentious wrote:
anarchy420x wrote:you didn't ask a question but made a statement. Did you have a question or did you just want to call their "God" a douche?

i didn't have a question, i had a vague understanding of God's theoretical nature and wanted an explaination. I also wanted to call God a douche :D


"God's" theoretical nature exists in so many forms it's baffling anyone actually picks one to believe in.
A broken clock is right twice a day, however, I am neither up that early nor up that late...
anarchy420x
Poster
Poster
 
Posts: 279
Joined: Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:43 am
Blog: View Blog (0)


Re: The "proof" of the Christian God being fake

Post by Threethumb on Tue Dec 18, 2012 7:10 am
([msg=71768]see Re: The "proof" of the Christian God being fake[/msg])

anarchy420x wrote:If got was Omnipotent, then he would most certainly make a rock so heavy he both could and could not lift it. He could certainly make it exist in every state all at once. Moreover, he might also choose not to create a paradox.


It is a paradox regardless of what "God chooses to do". A god like that can impossibly exist in our reality.
Threethumb
New User
New User
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Tue Dec 11, 2012 10:13 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)


Previous

Return to Religion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests