Encryption and Court Cases

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Re: Encryption and Court Cases

Post by novalyphe on Mon May 24, 2010 5:18 am
([msg=38971]see Re: Encryption and Court Cases[/msg])

myhexhax wrote:
novalyphe wrote:If a person had done nothing wrong, then no warrant would be requested or authorized and the issue does not apply. The authorities cannot randomly demand data/keys in the same way they cannot search your property without the necessary warrant. As the legislation stands at present you are not being asked to give up any of your "freedom". I'm not particularly worried about these powers in the same way I'm not worried about the police having the power to get a warrant and search my house.

Therefore, my logic is, if you are worried, you either believe that the government is out to get you, or you have something to hide.


I hope that you never sit on a jury. You assume because the police obtained a warrant or are monitoring someone that they are guilty or have done something wrong? Actually, you will never sit on a jury if that is true. You are innocent until proven guilty. The warrant is only to gather evidence to try to prove that guilt. They have the burden of proof. You do not have to prove you are innocent.You *are* innocent, until the jury of your peers (who hopefully do not have the same view as you), determine unanimously that you are guilty. Full stop. End of story. None of this "but if you have nothing to hide" hogwash. If you have nothing to hide, go live in a glass house.


Sorry if you somehow managed to glean the idea from my post that if a warrant is issued you must be guilty... My point was, that in the UK a JUDGE not just some random police officer must agree that there is sufficient evidence already to justify the issuing of a warrant, they aren't handed out on hunches. So unless they already have a very good reason for expecting to find something then they can't get a warrant. Even if they do then yes they still have to find enough evidence for CPS to agree to even take the case to court and then depending on the severity of the offence charged with you will have to be tried either by a magistrate or a judge and jury.

Using your own logic, if you are innocent of any crime, then even if they do search your property and take it all the way to court (even though CPS are usually very reluctant to do so unless there is compelling evidence in the first place) you must still be proven guilty. The chances of you being proven guilty beyond all reasonable doubt if you are in fact innocent, while real, are very slim, so I see little reason to worry... unless, as I say, you thing the government is out to get you and won't allow you a fair trial...

edit: typo
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Re: Encryption and Court Cases

Post by lord_hondros on Mon May 24, 2010 9:27 am
([msg=38974]see Re: Encryption and Court Cases[/msg])

Yeah, and the government always gives everyone a fair trial, right?

I mean, come on, how many cases are being reopened with DNA evidence from the 70's that are proving that people who were proven guilty are actually innocent? I can't think of the recent one, but I know there are many out there
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Re: Encryption and Court Cases

Post by Muskelmann098 on Tue Jun 07, 2011 1:53 pm
([msg=58184]see Re: Encryption and Court Cases[/msg])

I remember seeing a quote from around this site that answered the "if you have nothing to hide..." question very well.
It went something like:
"You have nothing to hide when you take a shit either, but that doesn't mean you would want me watching."
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