No, it is not saying that you cannot have both at the same time, but then again, the issue isn't about having money, it's about how you get that money. It is saying that you will show who you love by who, or what, you give your time to. He says that you will love one and hate the other. Which do you hate, Dredric?
i hate the offects of greed and selfishness and people who have a lot of money love it and hate it a the same time
they love the benefits of being weathy and they often hate what their greed does to the people in their family but they usualy dont atribute it to themselves
which do i hate?
well i love GOD
and i dont have a lot of money so it is really an invalid question
if i loved money (and what you quoted from the bible is correct )
which i believe it is
i would hate GOD but, i dont.
However, preaching was not part of the job description when you were hired. This means that if you preach on McDonalds time, you are doing a DIFFERENT job to what McDonalds hired you to do, or, in other words, you are showing your contempt for them by expecting them to pay you while you do work that does not benefit them.
On the other hand, if you claim to be a Christian, and yet you go off to do work OTHER than preach the gospel, then in the same way you show your contempt for God by expecting his salvation while you do work OTHER than what he told you to do. I dare say that people who try to serve both masters end up fitting into the category of "luke warm" described in Revelation
A man named Job( j-O-b not job) lived in the land of Uz. He was an honest man innocent of any wrong... He was the greatest man of all in the east (wealthy)! One day the angels came to show themselves before the Lord God. Satan also came with them. - Job 1:1,3
this verse describes Satan
How are you fallen from heaven O Lucifer(Morning Star)
How are you cast down to the ground
you who weaken the nations. - isaiah 14:12
Satan tested Job to try to prove to GOD that he would
curse God When his money was taken away
but Job prevailed.
i believe you can be rich and serve God but it may be harder.
as for this one -"Whoever does not forsake all he has cannot be my follower."
if you desire the things that you own more than GOD you will follow your possesions
Is the verse talking about desire? For example, if the admin of this site said "anyone who does not properly log in cannot post on the forum" would you then go on to tell yourself that what he really means is that as long as you believe in your heart that you've really logged in, then yo don't need to actually log in? It's worded as a command. If you don't do it, then you don't get into the club.
the definition is : Strong feeling of wanting to have something or wishing for something to happen.
has nothing it do with believing in your heart.
and sweety pie Saviour?
your are way off track that has nothing to do with it.
Regarding your correction to Jesus; it sounds to me like you are adding an interpretation to what the verse is actually saying that takes the edge off.
i am not correcting Jesus
i called this the "GOD logic"
not the "dredric1 logic"
i do not intend to correct GOD
i was stating my interpretation
not adding anything
If you take the sting out of his teachings (i.e. it's only something you think about in your heart, as opposed to something you actually DO) then Jesus is saying here that the teachings are no longer fit for shit.
if you believe it in you heart you will DO it.
A good tree does not bear rotten fruit and a rotten tree does not bear good fruit likewise your
heart is known by your actions. - Luke 6:43 - 45 i summerized this
tree = heart
fruit = actions things you DO
you are not saved by actions
as for the next one - "Sell what you have and give it to the poor."
Jesus was conversing with a specific person called the rich young ruler
the rich young ruler put his riches as the most important things in his life
Jesus was testing him to see if he was ready to follow him.
This is one of the oldest tricks in the book for Christians who can't imagine what it's like to actually obey Jesus. How the hell can you say that you are prepared, as a Christian, to lay your life down, Dredric, when you spew crap like this? I don't mind getting a bit strong with you here because this message is taught all throughout the new testament; it's one of the single most important values in the Kingdom of heaven and it's like a slap in the face to hear you dismiss it so carelessly.
To the pharisees he said...Luk 11:41 But rather give alms of such things as ye have; and, behold, all things are clean unto you.
To his disciples he said...Luk 12:33 Sell that ye have, and give alms; provide yourselves bags which wax not old, a treasure in the heavens that faileth not, where no thief approacheth, neither moth corrupteth.
Luk 12:34 For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.
To the guests at a dinner party...Luk 14:33 So likewise, whosoever he be of you that forsaketh not all that he hath, he cannot be my disciple.
To the rich he said...Luk 18:22 Now when Jesus heard these things, he said unto him, Yet lackest thou one thing: sell all that thou hast, and distribute unto the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, follow me.
Oh, and don't forget about his followers after he was gone...Act 2:44 And all that believed were together, and had all things common;
Act 2:45 And sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all [men], as every man had need.Act 4:34 Neither was there any among them that lacked: for as many as were possessors of lands or houses sold them, and brought the prices of the things that were sold,
Act 4:35 And laid [them] down at the apostles' feet: and distribution was made unto every man according as he had need.
Only for that one specific guy, you say? You sure do know how to put your foot in your mouth, Dredric.
the above statements involving giving money to the poor are important
it is saying , i think, that you should not be GREEDY, SELFISH, DISHONEST, UNCARING
in reference to this -"When someone hits you on one cheek, turn to him the other."
a more correct interpertation would be
"When someone hurts you it is better for them to hurt you again than you to take revenge on them that is greater that they desurve"
I agree with the first part of your sentence, up until the part "that is greater than they deserve". , "feel free to use knives and guns if you feel the need to defend yourself; just don't stab or shoot the guy more than he deserves". No wonder the world laughs at Christianity.
my statement has two parts
it is an either or statment not an inbetween
im sorry it was confusing
you put in a middle ground somthing that originaly wasnt there
it is saying it is better to be hit twice that to hurt the person greater than they hurt you
now what does that mean?
more? worse? over the top?
you twist my words to things that they dont mean
i will try to be more clear in the future
You come here challenging the whole forum by wanting to "help people" to understand that there really is a God, but when it comes to showing a really powerful example of his existence (i.e. a willingness for you to make some personal sacrifices) you suddenly lose your back bone and rely on guns and knives, as though that is the real truth that Jesus came to bring to the world.
i never said that it was the real truth
Stop judging and you will not be judged. Stop condemning and you will not be condemned - luke 6:37
you do not know what i rely on and i will not attempt to tell you because
you will condemn what is say
and for the last one - 'When people tell lies about you and say all manner of evil against you for my names sake, rejoice
it is more correct to say - "It is better to rejoice than to curse them because in the end everyone will be juged accourding to what evil they have done"
so you would rejoice knowing that the person that hurt you would in the end be judged justly
You are a real piece of work, Dre. I quoted Jesus word for word, but it seems you feel you know better than him. The gospel according to Dredric: "don't be upset when people are nasty to you; instead rejoice in knowing that in the end they'll get exactly what they deserve!"
i called this the "GOD logic"
not the "dredric1 logic"
i do not feel that i know better
im sorry if what i said lead you to believe that i thought that
and id have to say that you are being nasty to me in some respects
and if you believe that maybe it is time to look a yourself instead of
it is a pitty that you feel that it is your need to twist and judge and condemn
i intended this topic to have lots of debates not acusational arguments
that degrade to acusing people of being unable to follow God
i wanted it to be more loving than crude.
i oppologize if i have offended you
i would like you to know that it was not my intent
i realy do want to help people if i am not helping anyone than i can stop
i didnt start this topic intending to look intellegent or logical i was just sharing my beliefs
i pray asking GOD to give me guidance
but if my ideas are not wanted than i will leave it as is and find other ways to debate
You've totally missed the point of "for my names sake". Jesus asked people to love one another. That means that IF people are acting "for his names sake" then they are acting in love. If others come around saying nasty things about those actions, then the Christians have a reason to be happy in knowing that the accusations are false; there is no real case against love. It could also acts as evidence that the Christians are probably doing something right, because the accusers will probably be reacting in that "normal human selfishness" that Orwell described so eloquently earlier, and feel convicted by the kind of love that Jesus came to teach.
It is definitely NOT a teaching about feeling justified that people who hurt us at some time in the past will "get what they deserve" for it.
you are missing my point in what i said
the above statement you made about love is actualy more correct