New Python user

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Re: New Python user

Post by thedotmaster on Sat Sep 27, 2008 9:56 am
([msg=12640]see Re: New Python user[/msg])

No, because you are prone to skip bits out.
If you get bored easily and lose concentration then perhaps computers just aren't for you. You simply must learn the basics.
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Re: New Python user

Post by Defience on Sat Sep 27, 2008 10:22 am
([msg=12641]see Re: New Python user[/msg])

This is the perfect place to start: http://coolnamehere.com/geekery/python/pythontut.html
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Re: New Python user

Post by SeachMall on Sat Sep 27, 2008 2:20 pm
([msg=12655]see Re: New Python user[/msg])

thedotmaster wrote:No, because you are prone to skip bits out.
If you get bored easily and lose concentration then perhaps computers just aren't for you. You simply must learn the basics.

What do you mean by basics?

Variables, functions etc. or good coding practices?

If you don't practice what you're learning you won't learn a thing.
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Re: New Python user

Post by thedotmaster on Sat Sep 27, 2008 5:21 pm
([msg=12667]see Re: New Python user[/msg])

SeachMall wrote:What do you mean by basics?

Variables, functions etc. or good coding practices?

If you don't practice what you're learning you won't learn a thing.

By 'basics', I mean all of those things. It is crucial to learn how to program, as well as the syntax.
You are quite right that practice is crucial. However it isn't everything. I think the programming with projects approach to learning is the best way, but you must get the foundations down before you start programming.
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Re: New Python user

Post by SeachMall on Sat Sep 27, 2008 7:38 pm
([msg=12674]see Re: New Python user[/msg])

thedotmaster wrote:
SeachMall wrote:What do you mean by basics?

Variables, functions etc. or good coding practices?

If you don't practice what you're learning you won't learn a thing.

By 'basics', I mean all of those things. It is crucial to learn how to program, as well as the syntax.
You are quite right that practice is crucial. However it isn't everything. I think the programming with projects approach to learning is the best way, but you must get the foundations down before you start programming.

And I'm saying the best way to learn these foundations is to apply them to a real world project.

I've a feeling we're arguing the same point :| .
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Re: New Python user

Post by thedotmaster on Sat Sep 27, 2008 9:24 pm
([msg=12682]see Re: New Python user[/msg])

SeachMall wrote:And I'm saying the best way to learn these foundations is to apply them to a real world project.

I've a feeling we're arguing the same point :| .


No! I am saying that you cannot learn these foundations any other way but to read them, practice a little and THEN you can move onto doing projects. Picking them up as you go along as you might do with modules for example is NOT the way you ought to learn the foundations. Anything you learn as a foundation stays with you, so a bad habit at the start may remain with you for your entire time programming - or at least a good bit of it.
After you've learnt the basics, you need to start doing projects but also to read code.

For example, when learning variables - instead of making a chess game and realising you need to know about variables - learn them beforehand doing things like this:
Code: Select all
a = "hello";
b = "world";
print a,b;
print a+b;

We are not arguing the same point.
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Re: New Python user

Post by SeachMall on Sun Sep 28, 2008 6:07 am
([msg=12692]see Re: New Python user[/msg])

thedotmaster wrote:
SeachMall wrote:And I'm saying the best way to learn these foundations is to apply them to a real world project.

I've a feeling we're arguing the same point :| .


No! I am saying that you cannot learn these foundations any other way but to read them, practice a little and THEN you can move onto doing projects. Picking them up as you go along as you might do with modules for example is NOT the way you ought to learn the foundations. Anything you learn as a foundation stays with you, so a bad habit at the start may remain with you for your entire time programming - or at least a good bit of it.
After you've learnt the basics, you need to start doing projects but also to read code.


Well, I disagree. I think a project helps you to see how this stuff is practically used and because you're working in a project you'll have to refer back to them a number of times reinforcing them.

Agree to disagree?
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Re: New Python user

Post by thedotmaster on Sun Sep 28, 2008 1:43 pm
([msg=12715]see Re: New Python user[/msg])

Argh! Are you listening to me?
It is crucial to learn step-by-step the basics. I.e. variables and naming variables, programming techniques, basic syntax, security. The things you pick up as you go along are things such as modules, even perhaps arrays - that sort of thing.
Learning everything via projects makes you an awful programmer - but learning everything from a textbook doesn't do much good either. However, the first few bits should be learnt and practiced in short and then backed up with projects.
Now while you are correct that it is crucial to learn via projects too, I have been saying that from the start.
Reading others code, learning from a textbook and doing projects are all vital parts of learning a programming language.
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Re: New Python user

Post by Tenth_Prime on Mon Sep 29, 2008 4:01 pm
([msg=12813]see Re: New Python user[/msg])

oh good bore information for me glean knowledge from..


oh, and i agree with TheDotMaster, i understand what is being said about the basics... how do you multiply if you can't add?
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Re: New Python user

Post by thedotmaster on Mon Sep 29, 2008 4:41 pm
([msg=12815]see Re: New Python user[/msg])

Tenth_Prime wrote:how do you multiply if you can't add?

Exactly.
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